Un coup de pied dans la fourmilière contre la pollution… avec le dernier épisode du podcast CORDIScovery!
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CORDIScovery podcast- Episode #5 - EU researchers tackle pollution
This is an AI transcription.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:35:23
Abigail Acton
This is CORDIScovery. Hello and welcome to this episode of the CORDIScovery podcast with me, Abigail Acton. Today we'll be exploring how EU researchers are tackling pollution for a cleaner, greener Europe. In many areas, the pandemic has reduced our impact on the natural environment. But what will happen when we emerge from the restrictions and fire up our economies once again?
00:00:36:00 - 00:00:58:12
Abigail Acton
What impact will that have on pollution levels from oil spills that threaten our seas to the stinks that ruin our day? Pollution touches us at every level. Can we as individuals, really collect the data needed to get policymakers to tackle odor pollution? And if it takes time for industry to improve the quality of air in our urban environments, what can we do to make the air at home and in workspaces safer?
00:00:58:14 - 00:01:24:24
Abigail Acton
We can take steps to clean up the air around us in the environments we control. But how can we deal with larger scale pollution like oil spills and wastewater discharge? Today's three guests have all been supported by the EU's horizon 2020 program, in a bid to provide some solutions to these issues. I'm happy to welcome Rosa Arias, who is the coordinator of the D-NOSES Project, a chemical engineer with a background in odor pollution.
00:01:25:01 - 00:01:52:15
Abigail Acton
Her particular focus is on citizen science and science communication, and how that supports responsible research and innovation. Rosa is involved in the Spanish initiative science in the Parliament. Hello, Rosa. Hello. Senior technology advisor at Is Clean Air and senior tech lead at the Connected Places Catapult. Doctor Fabio Galatioto is interested in transport and the environment and air quality, and the innovative transition to sustainable cities.
00:01:52:17 - 00:01:54:20
Abigail Acton
He was involved in the APA project.
00:01:54:21 - 00:01:55:22
Fabio Galatioto
Hello everyone.
00:01:55:24 - 00:02:17:02
Abigail Acton
Doctor Ioannis Dontas coordinated the impressive project. He is the senior consultant at Aratus Limited and director of Research and Development at the Aratus Group. His focus is on the use of Earth observation data in various industries, but mainly on its application to environmental protection. Ioannis is also interested in innovative ICT. Welcome, Ioannis
00:02:17:04 - 00:02:17:15
Ioannis Dontas
Hello.
00:02:18:04 - 00:02:31:06
Abigail Acton
Rosa, you are the coordinator of the D-NOSES project, which gives people the tools they need to track and register the nuisance smells that trouble them. Of the various types of pollution that people could be identifying. Why did your team select odor?
00:02:31:08 - 00:02:56:04
Rosa Arias
I've been involved in odor pollution since 2004. It's a type of further pollution that constitutes the second cause of environmental complaints after noise accounting for around 30% of the complaints. But measuring others is not easy. So regulating others is not easy either. That's why, other pollution is under regulated, usually at the global level and in many European countries.
00:02:56:06 - 00:03:12:04
Rosa Arias
And we have an abundance here, which is that our nose is the best sensor that we can have to measure others. That's why we come up with a new methodology based on citizen science, to monitor other pollution. And that's quite. They project the notice was born.
00:03:12:09 - 00:03:30:21
Abigail Acton
Okay. Yeah. You're right. I mean, we walk around with the perfect sensor to judge this. And in fact, most of the time we're smelling things that, you know, occasionally maybe we don't like, but we can't really register that data. So it's great that you gave people the tools that they could. What tools did Dinos is give people to record hard facts and bring those to the attention of the authorities.
00:03:30:23 - 00:03:54:03
Rosa Arias
We have two main tools. The first one is the International Weather Observatory. In there we provide information in other pollution to any type of person that is interested. And we also have maps there where you can find affected communities, by other pollution all around the world. You can add your own and also add regulations in others.
00:03:54:05 - 00:04:26:20
Rosa Arias
But we have a second tool which is an app, which is called odor collect, where any people, can map, other observations, wherever you are, in any place at any time. It is real time data, that helps us understand, in which areas this pollution happens. Monitor and understand the problem with the intention of, finding, situations of improvement to, increase the quality of life of the citizens affected by the pollution.
00:04:26:22 - 00:04:33:09
Abigail Acton
And can you give us some idea of how many users are using the tool and also the website, and maybe you could get the website address?
00:04:33:11 - 00:04:57:13
Rosa Arias
Yes. The website is odorobservatory.org O-R-G and also the app is also odorcollect.edu. So you can also find it in the web. And we have now more than 9000 other observations all around the world and more than 1000 users, active users mapping observations in our case studies and become.
00:04:57:18 - 00:05:10:05
Abigail Acton
Oh, that's pretty impressive. Do you have any examples of how users and authorities are responding to the tools that you give them? Are they finding that the that it gives them the power to try and change the context that's bothering them?
00:05:10:07 - 00:05:33:00
Rosa Arias
Yes. For example, in Barcelona, I want to explain you something funny, because we like to co-create everything in our project. So we impose all types of officeholders, like the environmental authorities, the citizens, of course, the scientists and the other emitting industries. And since the project was focused on other pollution, we did an ad in the app, the option to map, good.
00:05:33:00 - 00:06:14:06
Rosa Arias
The smells. And the citizens in Barcelona ask us, to include this option because they mentioned that in this area they have some other issues related to waste and waste treatment, wastewater treatment plants. But sometimes it smells nice. So they also wanted to map and then and now the, A and B, which is the metropolitan area of Barcelona, which is the environmental authority in terms of the meeting, activities they are using or data to compare, it with the industrial processes, to find matches of the other episodes, to see what was going on there, to try to find and reduce and establish other management plans and increase the quality of life
00:06:14:06 - 00:06:15:03
Rosa Arias
of the population.
00:06:15:09 - 00:06:35:20
Abigail Acton
Oh that's fascinating. So you actually have direct, concrete examples of how how this can actually be harnessed to change things, because I think people feel very frustrated sometimes when they look at problems like pollution around them and feel that they, they can't do anything about it. That's that's really interesting. Rosa. Thank you. Does anyone have any questions to Rose of this notion of citizen science I think is very interesting.
00:06:35:22 - 00:06:36:24
Fabio Galatioto
Yes. I have a question.
00:06:36:24 - 00:06:37:20
Abigail Acton
Yes, Fabio.
00:06:37:22 - 00:06:52:23
Fabio Galatioto
Okay. Thanks. Rosa. My question is about actually the potential combination of your platform with tools like air purifier, like EPA that can actually intervene when and where is needed, from communities or local authorities?
00:06:52:24 - 00:07:18:15
Ioannis Dontas
Yes. Thank you for your question. The connection is very clear because of course, we need, systems such as air purifiers or others by a filters, etc. to reduce the other pollution on the population. So we can first map, for example, before you install an air purifier with the citizen symbol. And then after the installation, we can demonstrate the efficiency and the reduction, with the observations of the citizens.
00:07:18:15 - 00:07:19:24
Ioannis Dontas
So it's totally connected.
00:07:20:02 - 00:07:21:09
Fabio Galatioto
That's great. Thank you.
00:07:21:11 - 00:07:41:11
Abigail Acton
Yeah, it's a good synergy there. That's very good. Super. Well, Fabio, thank you for asking that question. And of course, this now brings you into the conversation. People can use tools such as those offered by Dino's is when they're out and about. But how can we at individual levels change our own environments? Now, I know that the APA project developed some really interesting next generation air purifiers.
00:07:41:13 - 00:07:53:06
Abigail Acton
The project was run by is clean air. The air purifiers that you've developed strip out a wide range of pollutants, both at domestic and industrial levels. I've always wondered just how effective air filters are. Fabio.
00:07:53:10 - 00:08:39:11
Fabio Galatioto
Thanks. Abigail from my position as the advisory role in the project is clean air. I've seen they developed a new concept of air purifier. And this is based, on and on water and their tools are actually being applied and not just at the industrial level where the project was focusing, but through the time they have been able to also, have consistently impressive results on and certified also by third party, both on particulate matter, airborne pollution and nitrogen dioxide, which is something that in urban area is very important and they have been able to reduce up to 50% on all outdoor spaces, the particles and 35, 40% the nitrogen dioxide, and in
00:08:39:11 - 00:09:03:08
Fabio Galatioto
particular in two recent applications like Milan. And I think also this is concept in terms of particulate matters is a very important at city level, which is going to be very important, especially once you implement electric vehicle, that component won't go away straight away. And this is important because Arpa is not only focusing on the particle matter one Pm10.
00:09:03:08 - 00:09:09:12
Fabio Galatioto
So larger size, but also very nanoparticles also as low as a ten nanometer ten nanometers.
00:09:09:12 - 00:09:16:23
Abigail Acton
That's tiny. That's smaller than viruses. So can your panels also filter out viruses? A question obviously that's on most people's lips at the moment.
00:09:17:04 - 00:10:00:15
Fabio Galatioto
Yes. And that's exactly my point in that sense. Very small particles. The nanometer is a 1015 times smaller than viruses like coronaviruses. We are all know now. And this has been certified that it will be before actually the pandemia, started off. And for this reason, there is clean air as received with the APA panel, the certification as a class one medical device from the Italian Ministry of Health and, very recently, also because they are the only one using water, you can think about the possibility to sample their water and check if there is a presence of viruses, within the water.
00:10:00:15 - 00:10:10:08
Fabio Galatioto
Even killed already because the system can kill the virus. But actually you can detect if in an indoor environment there is a presence of threat from virus.
00:10:10:14 - 00:10:26:04
Abigail Acton
Oh that's fascinating. So in fact, it could also be a way for health authorities to track the spread. If they could find a way of of doing this effectively and efficiently, at least a little bit like tracking the spread of the virus in the sewage systems as well. So in the air and in the air, it's very it's interesting.
00:10:26:04 - 00:10:27:07
Abigail Acton
We have a lot of data.
00:10:27:09 - 00:10:33:09
Fabio Galatioto
But yeah, local actually application because you can do indoor and not in a court or a large city scale.
00:10:33:14 - 00:10:49:21
Abigail Acton
Yeah. No fascinating. It's very interesting. So you mentioned water being, a major part of the technology and how these, these panels function. Could you explain to us a little bit about the dimension of the panels and how much, air they can purify and also how it works?
00:10:49:23 - 00:11:14:00
Fabio Galatioto
Yes, exactly. Basically, they are based on water and their size is of the upper system panel, is about two meter by one, and 40 centimeter depth, like the one used in cities. And they require only, less than a kilowatt per hour to clean up to 4000 cubic meter per hour, which is quite a lot in our urban area.
00:11:14:02 - 00:11:40:21
Fabio Galatioto
And also they, because they don't use the filters, but just water, they basically reproduce the, cleaning power of the rainfall, the natural, rainfall. And this is also important because without the filters, they are actually reducing quite a lot the burden in terms of changing the filter, also consuming more energy over time. And they literally continue to clean at the same rate every day for months.
00:11:40:23 - 00:12:21:21
Fabio Galatioto
And the water use has been certified to be clean as a rainfall so they can be discharge on normal sewage. And that is, sort of the most sustainable way. And that has been recognized by the Solar Impulse Foundation a few days ago, has been launched. And, in terms of the, the opportunity I think is not just about the air pollution abatement, but, we see, filters, not actually their competitors, but potential, opportunity in there because, in a recent project, we have been, founded from the Italian government we are introducing and, near zero air pollution building.
00:12:21:21 - 00:12:46:23
Fabio Galatioto
Com set where the screen as, proposal to attach the their system into an air treatment unit, and they usually get very obstructed by the filters, by, particles increasing exponentially their energy consumption and by integration of EPA system with their units. You can reduce up to 25% of total energy consumption.
00:12:47:00 - 00:13:03:00
Abigail Acton
Oh that's excellent. So it's sort of a combination of the two systems can actually be greater than the sum of each individual part. That's fascinating. Very interesting. And are you locating these on the streets or in, I mean, everywhere, people's houses, streets, hospitals or at the moment where in particular, I mean.
00:13:03:00 - 00:13:26:14
Fabio Galatioto
So far, more than under 30 installation has been done by clean air, both in, indoor or outdoor industrial urban area. We have recently won, an innovation grant for testing the virus as well in an in indoor environment, related to medical and also in, as, as small as an office space.
00:13:26:16 - 00:13:29:20
Abigail Acton
Excellent. Absolutely. Excellent. So I look forward to being able to buy one. Yeah, we.
00:13:29:20 - 00:13:32:03
Fabio Galatioto
Are in discussion actually, with large groups.
00:13:32:05 - 00:13:38:12
Abigail Acton
Sometimes. Fantastic. I look forward to that. Does anyone have any questions for Fabio? It's a very fascinating technology I think.
00:13:38:16 - 00:13:39:19
Rosa Arias
I have a question.
00:13:39:22 - 00:13:41:06
Abigail Acton
Thank you. Rosa.
00:13:41:08 - 00:14:04:06
Rosa Arias
Fabio, I really liked your idea. It's wonderful. And I wonder if we can have a connection also with others because, with other colleagues, you can map, smell of, traffic in the streets, for example, which, as you know, they have a lot of particles in the air. And there is a lot of, I know there are citizen science project, which, is measuring particles with low-cost sensors.
00:14:04:08 - 00:14:15:04
Rosa Arias
And I wonder that maybe we can combine, in these busy streets. Your technology. I my question for you is if you think that this could be useful for the citizens.
00:14:15:06 - 00:14:49:08
Fabio Galatioto
Yes, definitely. And that's why I'm asked the question before, because I think your system can actually detect where the problem is not just, known, but perceived. And that's very important. The small the message to for awareness, but also for, health benefits. And just recently we heard about the, the court low, case from the little child that has been recognizing air quality, and PM in particular, as a key element, you know, factory within.
00:14:49:10 - 00:15:04:22
Abigail Acton
Yes. This is referring to a case that occurred, a while ago, but, finally has been, the death of a child has finally been attributed officially to, air pollution and, a consequent asthma attack caused by, by by severe levels of air.
00:15:04:22 - 00:15:11:11
Fabio Galatioto
Pollution as a contributing factor. Yeah, not the only factor, of course, but as a contributing factor. And it is very important.
00:15:11:13 - 00:15:30:20
Abigail Acton
Right. Absolutely. Thank you very much, both of you. Well, that sounds like there's some interesting synergies and potentials there. Good. Ioannis has been working on a project called the Impressive Project. And the impressive project has been looking at how to tackle pollution. On a perhaps not on a different scale, but in a very different, environment.
00:15:30:22 - 00:15:48:20
Abigail Acton
The impressive project is concerned with maritime pollution, oil spills and, also wastewater discharges. So Ioannis if I could turn to you? Sometimes it takes a machine to get a job done. Can you tell me a little bit more how the impressive project is using drones and unmanned vehicles to track pollution?
00:15:48:20 - 00:16:16:03
Ioannis Dontas
Yes. Thank you. Abigail. Actually, we wanted to to go further beyond the traditional methods of early inspection and monitoring. This is the basic scope of this kind of work. The oil spill inspection and a quick inspection. And, monitoring of the behavior of the oil spill or the waste waters in the maritime area, in the outside of the garbage and in the vicinity.
00:16:16:05 - 00:16:40:23
Ioannis Dontas
So we wanted to we just use a notebook that a drone and the small catamaran has model A is very, very clean over sailing over the sea. In order to go over the area of the oil spill and, take a small sample of it and check it later on and inspect the, the oil spill and the, its behavior.
00:16:41:00 - 00:16:43:08
Ioannis Dontas
That was the initial idea of it.
00:16:43:10 - 00:16:48:00
Abigail Acton
And how did the idea develop? What sort of data were you able are you able to collect?
00:16:48:02 - 00:17:09:00
Ioannis Dontas
First of all, we need to have something some as an initial triggering, effect, this initial triggering effect for the existence of a potential oil spill somewhere, could be can be delivered from the Earth. Observation data from the satellite to the monitor, all the or all over the Earth, all day, all the time.
00:17:09:02 - 00:17:21:21
Abigail Acton
Okay, so if I may interrupt you, just to be clear, so you get some data from Earth observation satellites, and that might indicate that there is, a spill or discharge, event happening. And at that point, what do you do exactly?
00:17:21:21 - 00:17:56:05
Ioannis Dontas
And then we have this indication of the oil spill and the I automatically unlock the work that is getting is getting off and goes over the area, the suspicious area for an oil spill, and takes some higher resolution pictures in order to give more evidence to the ignition triggering information from the satellite. Then if we if the authorities have the proof that this is this is indeed, noise spill and has more catamaran can go automatically at this specific area and get with a robotic arm.
00:17:56:07 - 00:18:18:03
Ioannis Dontas
As more summary of the water and take it back to the laboratory for testing. This is the way the port authorities can have on their hands. Strong. Maybe this is for, all these species, all the waste water from ships in order to pursue, the shipowners for this kind of pollution.
00:18:18:06 - 00:18:44:17
Abigail Acton
That's fascinating. So basically, these are tools to, to to bring polluters to justice in a way to, to ensure that the polluter really does pay, come the data that's picked up by these autonomous vehicles, and give you the information to actually identify who potentially the polluter was. Do you get enough granular data to be able to pinpoint, who has actually made the discharge or whether where the spill has come from?
00:18:44:19 - 00:19:08:10
Ioannis Dontas
The answer is yes and no. It becomes independent from the in depends on the timing or everything you say is depending on the correct timing. Because when the ship is passing by outside the harbor, okay, the satellite may have a picture of it from the previous hours. And of course, everybody knows the specific position of the ship and specifically their Port Authority's.
00:19:08:12 - 00:19:33:24
Ioannis Dontas
The drone can have a picture of the ship. Also, if the ship usually is in the same position at the time, if the discharges the waste water, for example, we can capture the sea at the very moment, you know, and this is the whole idea and of course the catamaran. Okay. The catamaran can not have a car, does not have a camera and need in order to inspect.
00:19:34:01 - 00:19:45:17
Ioannis Dontas
But until we send automatically the catamaran to take the the oil spill, the sample, we already know who is and what she has done.
00:19:45:21 - 00:20:02:08
Abigail Acton
So, I mean, people have been extracting samples of spills and trying to identify the perpetrators of pollution events. For a while. Your system is autonomous. Can you let us know specifically what what the main differences are and why your approach is so, is so useful?
00:20:02:08 - 00:20:26:24
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, I can tell you that it's a question of precision. It's a question of cost, and it's a question of safety or safety. We need precision in order to to know exactly who has done what and not what the exact time. Of course you need to cut the costs of, we do not want to send people over there to do this job anymore.
00:20:26:24 - 00:20:56:18
Ioannis Dontas
We, people have done, this work a lot of times in the past, sometimes successfully, sometimes not successfully. Then we want to cut the costs down of it. And of course, it's a question of safety for the workers of the port. Authorities would go there and take the salary if the weather is bad, severe or whatever, it's better the machines do this kind of a job, more accurately sometimes.
00:20:56:23 - 00:20:58:17
Ioannis Dontas
And more safety for, as I think.
00:20:58:17 - 00:21:01:03
Abigail Acton
Also, you mentioned, of course, the.
00:21:01:03 - 00:21:02:05
Ioannis Dontas
The, the.
00:21:02:05 - 00:21:20:08
Abigail Acton
The need for real time information and speed and rapidity so that perhaps the, the person, the perpetrator of the pollution event has not gone too far or can still be identified, I guess also deploying these, these systems that are automated is also more rapid than trying to get a response, a human response. A group of people together.
00:21:20:14 - 00:21:52:15
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, exactly. Such a system can be used by the port authorities for constant monitoring of the maritime area around the harbor in all the or the vicinity of the several other areas, the coast lines, etc. and such a system can be used constantly, 24 hours per day, seven days a week, in order to provide, constant information about the status, of the, of the sea, surroundings.
00:21:52:17 - 00:22:26:13
Ioannis Dontas
And of course, this is the basic, use, of course, of such a system. It can be used heavily. It's a system about the can be used for other types of monitoring, pure, environmental monitoring. I would say, the heat of the waves, we can we can have such measurements from the satellites. We can induce these measurements into the systems of the system of ours and have the drones make, some more accurate measurements in order to justify the satellite measurements, etc..
00:22:26:13 - 00:22:30:13
Ioannis Dontas
Scientists love that. A lot of those things guess.
00:22:30:14 - 00:22:48:06
Abigail Acton
And maybe algal blooms. Yeah. Algal blooms as well. Perhaps, you know, eutrophication where there's a sudden rush of algal blooms that show up on satellites. I can see the perhaps sampling those could be really useful for data as well. No, that's absolutely fascinating. Ioannis. Thank you very much. Rosa do you have any questions to put to Ioannis?
00:22:48:06 - 00:22:49:19
Rosa Arias
Yes, I have one question.
00:22:49:19 - 00:22:50:15
Abigail Acton
Yes. Reza.
00:22:50:17 - 00:23:16:08
Rosa Arias
I wonder that, what triggers, your methodology is the Earth observations, right. So I'm wondering, how quick you can act after these. And if you think that maybe citizens can help you monitoring also the spills or, other, phenomena that you want to report because, just as an example, the European Environmental Agency has an app which is called marine litter.
00:23:16:08 - 00:23:40:21
Rosa Arias
What? Which is informing directly the European directive, to our own data on pollution and marine pollution. And, well, it's not focus on spills. It's more, marine litter in the beaches, etc. but perhaps a combination of both could help identify quicker. This is because of the disconnect. Quicker if, Earth observations are not quick enough, which is my question.
00:23:40:23 - 00:24:12:20
Ioannis Dontas
Thank you for the question. Hey, my answer is that the Earth observation datasets for this kind of job can be frequent enough for this, for the use in our in our work, we can have several measurements from satellites for 24 hours. And apart from that, in order to, to cover the remaining timeslots of the day, we can use the drone, in order to inspect the overall area outside of the harbor.
00:24:12:22 - 00:24:41:03
Ioannis Dontas
On the other hand, I could say that the citizen science is indeed used for, litter or, garbage is in the in the sea. And the it was, in it is a successful movement. But regarding oil species, I think that it's not easy to involve the passengers of another ship to do to take the ocean there and give me such kind of information easily.
00:24:41:05 - 00:25:05:22
Ioannis Dontas
Because they are almost very near to the level of the oil spill, and they cannot see it very easily when they are passing by from another ship, for example, the only spills or waste of water is, more easily seen from above, either from satellites or from drones. And this is why we use we use this methodology.
00:25:06:03 - 00:25:22:05
Ioannis Dontas
Of course. It is a very nice idea. Perhaps in the future, citizens flying, over the areas with helicopters or small airplanes, then we could use this capability.
00:25:22:10 - 00:25:40:04
Abigail Acton
But it's the bird's eye view. You really need to get the idea of The Expanse. I hadn't thought of that because, I was also interested very much in Rosa's question. It seemed like a, a logical point. But as soon as you mentioned the notion of the fact that if you're actually down on the water level, you can't really get a clear idea of of what's actually happening in terms of the extent of the spill and so on.
00:25:40:05 - 00:26:02:20
Abigail Acton
Yes, absolutely. Ioannis. I have an extra question for you. I'm wondering whether the data that your systems have collected have actually ever been used, to, to bring perpetrators to book. In other words, have you ever had your data used in, in, in criminal cases or, or, have they been used in, to, to assert liability?
00:26:02:22 - 00:26:39:00
Ioannis Dontas
The only thing I can tell you is that, regarding some recent incidents of the oil species, in Greece and Spain, in the last, 5 or 6 years, if there was this solution on air, we could have avoided. And this, very big, this distributed environment of these activities. Actually, we have the our solution has not been used in some court or anything similar because we are we are still in the we are ending the project this time.
00:26:39:06 - 00:26:50:10
Ioannis Dontas
We are still in the demonstration stage. Absolutely. This time, but we hope in the future. Yes. So we have already some positive reactions from Port authorities.
00:26:50:13 - 00:26:56:08
Abigail Acton
So perpetrators watch how to drone is coming to you. Yes. Excellent. Yes. Fabian.
00:26:56:09 - 00:27:16:19
Fabio Galatioto
My question was about actually applying not just on sea but also on rivers, because, actually rivers, they there are also industrial, emissions. And that could be I should I add in UK that there were quite a lot of spills from industry that are not detected. Exactly, exactly. It can it can be used, of course.
00:27:16:20 - 00:27:46:19
Ioannis Dontas
I was wondering how big has to be the surface water to detect any. So we are currently monitoring rivers and lakes from this from satellites. Okay. Yet a lot of very valuable vulnerable data. Imagine that we can detect from satellites the concentration of nitrogen, not oxygen. What are other, substances diluted in the water of lakes and rivers and so we have the the request, the required resolution to do this.
00:27:46:21 - 00:27:47:04
Ioannis Dontas
Of course.
00:27:47:05 - 00:28:14:10
Rosa Arias
That's wonderful. And by the way, I have a, case study in dynamics where we are investigating industrial spills in rivers in one three. Very important. Well, which is called Rio Tinto. So yes, we can have a connection, but we are, investigating them by the smell, like citizens looking by if they smell chemical products or something in the water of the river, then they map and we are understanding if they come from industries or not.
00:28:14:12 - 00:28:40:08
Ioannis Dontas
Yeah. If the smell is translated actually in reality to a small for glory cloud or something, it can be seen from the, from the satellite, imagine that the satellite can see can detect the hydrocarbons getting out from a broken pipeline gas pipeline, for example. And it can see the concentration of the hydrocarbons nearby the pipeline crack.
00:28:40:10 - 00:28:47:13
Ioannis Dontas
So yeah. So you can have a satellite, the information just for comparing your your own methodology.
00:28:47:14 - 00:28:56:18
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, yes. No. That is a new field. That is a opening like the connection of citizen generating data and satellite data. So for me it's super interesting.
00:28:56:18 - 00:28:57:16
Abigail Acton
Very interesting for all of us.
00:28:57:18 - 00:28:59:24
Rosa Arias
So I really love both of your projects.
00:28:59:24 - 00:29:04:09
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, I began, I think it was a very nice discussion.
00:29:04:11 - 00:29:31:07
Abigail Acton
Yeah. You see, I brought together three very interesting people. Okay. Well, I really want to thank you all very much for sharing your time with us this morning and, for talking through your your really fascinating projects. I like the way that you're all tackling one common problem, but some rather different angles. And, Fabio and Rosa, who knows whether there might be some, some synergies that could develop between between your two, technologies and your approaches.
00:29:31:09 - 00:29:47:13
Abigail Acton
Ioannis we all really wish you a huge amount of luck in the future with regards to being able to bring people to book. I really hope that the information you you managed to get from the data can actually be used to pin people down for for liability and responsibility. Thank you so much for joining us this morning.
00:29:47:14 - 00:29:48:09
Rosa Arias
Thank you.
00:29:49:11 - 00:29:51:03
Fabio Galatioto
Thank you everyone.
00:29:52:07 - 00:30:22:11
Abigail Acton
interested in what other EU funded projects are doing to tackle pollution? Take a look at issue 1 or 2 of the research EU magazine available on the court's website. Cordis.europa.eu from blue sky speculative research that opens the doors for tomorrow's technologies to research tightly focused on finding solutions to the challenges we are facing right now. Cordis highlights work being done in a wide range of fields daily news, articles, interviews, a magazine, and research packs exploring projects from specific domains.
00:30:22:12 - 00:30:41:09
Abigail Acton
The Cordis website has your next long read or coffee break skim through. Interested in applying for EU research grants? Visit the website to see how your work relates to that currently being done in your field. So come and check out the research that's revealing what makes our world tick. Our next episode pokes its head into the virtual reality revolution.
00:30:41:14 - 00:31:03:09
Abigail Acton
What novel devices are coming our way? Will they transport us to new worlds? Change the way we learn? Bring people together. Join me to find out. We're always happy to hear from you. So drop us a line editorial@cordis.europa.eu. Until next time.
This is an AI transcription.
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:35:23
Abigail Acton
This is CORDIScovery. Hello and welcome to this episode of the CORDIScovery podcast with me, Abigail Acton. Today we'll be exploring how EU researchers are tackling pollution for a cleaner, greener Europe. In many areas, the pandemic has reduced our impact on the natural environment. But what will happen when we emerge from the restrictions and fire up our economies once again?
00:00:36:00 - 00:00:58:12
Abigail Acton
What impact will that have on pollution levels from oil spills that threaten our seas to the stinks that ruin our day? Pollution touches us at every level. Can we as individuals, really collect the data needed to get policymakers to tackle odor pollution? And if it takes time for industry to improve the quality of air in our urban environments, what can we do to make the air at home and in workspaces safer?
00:00:58:14 - 00:01:24:24
Abigail Acton
We can take steps to clean up the air around us in the environments we control. But how can we deal with larger scale pollution like oil spills and wastewater discharge? Today's three guests have all been supported by the EU's horizon 2020 program, in a bid to provide some solutions to these issues. I'm happy to welcome Rosa Arias, who is the coordinator of the D-NOSES Project, a chemical engineer with a background in odor pollution.
00:01:25:01 - 00:01:52:15
Abigail Acton
Her particular focus is on citizen science and science communication, and how that supports responsible research and innovation. Rosa is involved in the Spanish initiative science in the Parliament. Hello, Rosa. Hello. Senior technology advisor at Is Clean Air and senior tech lead at the Connected Places Catapult. Doctor Fabio Galatioto is interested in transport and the environment and air quality, and the innovative transition to sustainable cities.
00:01:52:17 - 00:01:54:20
Abigail Acton
He was involved in the APA project.
00:01:54:21 - 00:01:55:22
Fabio Galatioto
Hello everyone.
00:01:55:24 - 00:02:17:02
Abigail Acton
Doctor Ioannis Dontas coordinated the impressive project. He is the senior consultant at Aratus Limited and director of Research and Development at the Aratus Group. His focus is on the use of Earth observation data in various industries, but mainly on its application to environmental protection. Ioannis is also interested in innovative ICT. Welcome, Ioannis
00:02:17:04 - 00:02:17:15
Ioannis Dontas
Hello.
00:02:18:04 - 00:02:31:06
Abigail Acton
Rosa, you are the coordinator of the D-NOSES project, which gives people the tools they need to track and register the nuisance smells that trouble them. Of the various types of pollution that people could be identifying. Why did your team select odor?
00:02:31:08 - 00:02:56:04
Rosa Arias
I've been involved in odor pollution since 2004. It's a type of further pollution that constitutes the second cause of environmental complaints after noise accounting for around 30% of the complaints. But measuring others is not easy. So regulating others is not easy either. That's why, other pollution is under regulated, usually at the global level and in many European countries.
00:02:56:06 - 00:03:12:04
Rosa Arias
And we have an abundance here, which is that our nose is the best sensor that we can have to measure others. That's why we come up with a new methodology based on citizen science, to monitor other pollution. And that's quite. They project the notice was born.
00:03:12:09 - 00:03:30:21
Abigail Acton
Okay. Yeah. You're right. I mean, we walk around with the perfect sensor to judge this. And in fact, most of the time we're smelling things that, you know, occasionally maybe we don't like, but we can't really register that data. So it's great that you gave people the tools that they could. What tools did Dinos is give people to record hard facts and bring those to the attention of the authorities.
00:03:30:23 - 00:03:54:03
Rosa Arias
We have two main tools. The first one is the International Weather Observatory. In there we provide information in other pollution to any type of person that is interested. And we also have maps there where you can find affected communities, by other pollution all around the world. You can add your own and also add regulations in others.
00:03:54:05 - 00:04:26:20
Rosa Arias
But we have a second tool which is an app, which is called odor collect, where any people, can map, other observations, wherever you are, in any place at any time. It is real time data, that helps us understand, in which areas this pollution happens. Monitor and understand the problem with the intention of, finding, situations of improvement to, increase the quality of life of the citizens affected by the pollution.
00:04:26:22 - 00:04:33:09
Abigail Acton
And can you give us some idea of how many users are using the tool and also the website, and maybe you could get the website address?
00:04:33:11 - 00:04:57:13
Rosa Arias
Yes. The website is odorobservatory.org O-R-G and also the app is also odorcollect.edu. So you can also find it in the web. And we have now more than 9000 other observations all around the world and more than 1000 users, active users mapping observations in our case studies and become.
00:04:57:18 - 00:05:10:05
Abigail Acton
Oh, that's pretty impressive. Do you have any examples of how users and authorities are responding to the tools that you give them? Are they finding that the that it gives them the power to try and change the context that's bothering them?
00:05:10:07 - 00:05:33:00
Rosa Arias
Yes. For example, in Barcelona, I want to explain you something funny, because we like to co-create everything in our project. So we impose all types of officeholders, like the environmental authorities, the citizens, of course, the scientists and the other emitting industries. And since the project was focused on other pollution, we did an ad in the app, the option to map, good.
00:05:33:00 - 00:06:14:06
Rosa Arias
The smells. And the citizens in Barcelona ask us, to include this option because they mentioned that in this area they have some other issues related to waste and waste treatment, wastewater treatment plants. But sometimes it smells nice. So they also wanted to map and then and now the, A and B, which is the metropolitan area of Barcelona, which is the environmental authority in terms of the meeting, activities they are using or data to compare, it with the industrial processes, to find matches of the other episodes, to see what was going on there, to try to find and reduce and establish other management plans and increase the quality of life
00:06:14:06 - 00:06:15:03
Rosa Arias
of the population.
00:06:15:09 - 00:06:35:20
Abigail Acton
Oh that's fascinating. So you actually have direct, concrete examples of how how this can actually be harnessed to change things, because I think people feel very frustrated sometimes when they look at problems like pollution around them and feel that they, they can't do anything about it. That's that's really interesting. Rosa. Thank you. Does anyone have any questions to Rose of this notion of citizen science I think is very interesting.
00:06:35:22 - 00:06:36:24
Fabio Galatioto
Yes. I have a question.
00:06:36:24 - 00:06:37:20
Abigail Acton
Yes, Fabio.
00:06:37:22 - 00:06:52:23
Fabio Galatioto
Okay. Thanks. Rosa. My question is about actually the potential combination of your platform with tools like air purifier, like EPA that can actually intervene when and where is needed, from communities or local authorities?
00:06:52:24 - 00:07:18:15
Ioannis Dontas
Yes. Thank you for your question. The connection is very clear because of course, we need, systems such as air purifiers or others by a filters, etc. to reduce the other pollution on the population. So we can first map, for example, before you install an air purifier with the citizen symbol. And then after the installation, we can demonstrate the efficiency and the reduction, with the observations of the citizens.
00:07:18:15 - 00:07:19:24
Ioannis Dontas
So it's totally connected.
00:07:20:02 - 00:07:21:09
Fabio Galatioto
That's great. Thank you.
00:07:21:11 - 00:07:41:11
Abigail Acton
Yeah, it's a good synergy there. That's very good. Super. Well, Fabio, thank you for asking that question. And of course, this now brings you into the conversation. People can use tools such as those offered by Dino's is when they're out and about. But how can we at individual levels change our own environments? Now, I know that the APA project developed some really interesting next generation air purifiers.
00:07:41:13 - 00:07:53:06
Abigail Acton
The project was run by is clean air. The air purifiers that you've developed strip out a wide range of pollutants, both at domestic and industrial levels. I've always wondered just how effective air filters are. Fabio.
00:07:53:10 - 00:08:39:11
Fabio Galatioto
Thanks. Abigail from my position as the advisory role in the project is clean air. I've seen they developed a new concept of air purifier. And this is based, on and on water and their tools are actually being applied and not just at the industrial level where the project was focusing, but through the time they have been able to also, have consistently impressive results on and certified also by third party, both on particulate matter, airborne pollution and nitrogen dioxide, which is something that in urban area is very important and they have been able to reduce up to 50% on all outdoor spaces, the particles and 35, 40% the nitrogen dioxide, and in
00:08:39:11 - 00:09:03:08
Fabio Galatioto
particular in two recent applications like Milan. And I think also this is concept in terms of particulate matters is a very important at city level, which is going to be very important, especially once you implement electric vehicle, that component won't go away straight away. And this is important because Arpa is not only focusing on the particle matter one Pm10.
00:09:03:08 - 00:09:09:12
Fabio Galatioto
So larger size, but also very nanoparticles also as low as a ten nanometer ten nanometers.
00:09:09:12 - 00:09:16:23
Abigail Acton
That's tiny. That's smaller than viruses. So can your panels also filter out viruses? A question obviously that's on most people's lips at the moment.
00:09:17:04 - 00:10:00:15
Fabio Galatioto
Yes. And that's exactly my point in that sense. Very small particles. The nanometer is a 1015 times smaller than viruses like coronaviruses. We are all know now. And this has been certified that it will be before actually the pandemia, started off. And for this reason, there is clean air as received with the APA panel, the certification as a class one medical device from the Italian Ministry of Health and, very recently, also because they are the only one using water, you can think about the possibility to sample their water and check if there is a presence of viruses, within the water.
00:10:00:15 - 00:10:10:08
Fabio Galatioto
Even killed already because the system can kill the virus. But actually you can detect if in an indoor environment there is a presence of threat from virus.
00:10:10:14 - 00:10:26:04
Abigail Acton
Oh that's fascinating. So in fact, it could also be a way for health authorities to track the spread. If they could find a way of of doing this effectively and efficiently, at least a little bit like tracking the spread of the virus in the sewage systems as well. So in the air and in the air, it's very it's interesting.
00:10:26:04 - 00:10:27:07
Abigail Acton
We have a lot of data.
00:10:27:09 - 00:10:33:09
Fabio Galatioto
But yeah, local actually application because you can do indoor and not in a court or a large city scale.
00:10:33:14 - 00:10:49:21
Abigail Acton
Yeah. No fascinating. It's very interesting. So you mentioned water being, a major part of the technology and how these, these panels function. Could you explain to us a little bit about the dimension of the panels and how much, air they can purify and also how it works?
00:10:49:23 - 00:11:14:00
Fabio Galatioto
Yes, exactly. Basically, they are based on water and their size is of the upper system panel, is about two meter by one, and 40 centimeter depth, like the one used in cities. And they require only, less than a kilowatt per hour to clean up to 4000 cubic meter per hour, which is quite a lot in our urban area.
00:11:14:02 - 00:11:40:21
Fabio Galatioto
And also they, because they don't use the filters, but just water, they basically reproduce the, cleaning power of the rainfall, the natural, rainfall. And this is also important because without the filters, they are actually reducing quite a lot the burden in terms of changing the filter, also consuming more energy over time. And they literally continue to clean at the same rate every day for months.
00:11:40:23 - 00:12:21:21
Fabio Galatioto
And the water use has been certified to be clean as a rainfall so they can be discharge on normal sewage. And that is, sort of the most sustainable way. And that has been recognized by the Solar Impulse Foundation a few days ago, has been launched. And, in terms of the, the opportunity I think is not just about the air pollution abatement, but, we see, filters, not actually their competitors, but potential, opportunity in there because, in a recent project, we have been, founded from the Italian government we are introducing and, near zero air pollution building.
00:12:21:21 - 00:12:46:23
Fabio Galatioto
Com set where the screen as, proposal to attach the their system into an air treatment unit, and they usually get very obstructed by the filters, by, particles increasing exponentially their energy consumption and by integration of EPA system with their units. You can reduce up to 25% of total energy consumption.
00:12:47:00 - 00:13:03:00
Abigail Acton
Oh that's excellent. So it's sort of a combination of the two systems can actually be greater than the sum of each individual part. That's fascinating. Very interesting. And are you locating these on the streets or in, I mean, everywhere, people's houses, streets, hospitals or at the moment where in particular, I mean.
00:13:03:00 - 00:13:26:14
Fabio Galatioto
So far, more than under 30 installation has been done by clean air, both in, indoor or outdoor industrial urban area. We have recently won, an innovation grant for testing the virus as well in an in indoor environment, related to medical and also in, as, as small as an office space.
00:13:26:16 - 00:13:29:20
Abigail Acton
Excellent. Absolutely. Excellent. So I look forward to being able to buy one. Yeah, we.
00:13:29:20 - 00:13:32:03
Fabio Galatioto
Are in discussion actually, with large groups.
00:13:32:05 - 00:13:38:12
Abigail Acton
Sometimes. Fantastic. I look forward to that. Does anyone have any questions for Fabio? It's a very fascinating technology I think.
00:13:38:16 - 00:13:39:19
Rosa Arias
I have a question.
00:13:39:22 - 00:13:41:06
Abigail Acton
Thank you. Rosa.
00:13:41:08 - 00:14:04:06
Rosa Arias
Fabio, I really liked your idea. It's wonderful. And I wonder if we can have a connection also with others because, with other colleagues, you can map, smell of, traffic in the streets, for example, which, as you know, they have a lot of particles in the air. And there is a lot of, I know there are citizen science project, which, is measuring particles with low-cost sensors.
00:14:04:08 - 00:14:15:04
Rosa Arias
And I wonder that maybe we can combine, in these busy streets. Your technology. I my question for you is if you think that this could be useful for the citizens.
00:14:15:06 - 00:14:49:08
Fabio Galatioto
Yes, definitely. And that's why I'm asked the question before, because I think your system can actually detect where the problem is not just, known, but perceived. And that's very important. The small the message to for awareness, but also for, health benefits. And just recently we heard about the, the court low, case from the little child that has been recognizing air quality, and PM in particular, as a key element, you know, factory within.
00:14:49:10 - 00:15:04:22
Abigail Acton
Yes. This is referring to a case that occurred, a while ago, but, finally has been, the death of a child has finally been attributed officially to, air pollution and, a consequent asthma attack caused by, by by severe levels of air.
00:15:04:22 - 00:15:11:11
Fabio Galatioto
Pollution as a contributing factor. Yeah, not the only factor, of course, but as a contributing factor. And it is very important.
00:15:11:13 - 00:15:30:20
Abigail Acton
Right. Absolutely. Thank you very much, both of you. Well, that sounds like there's some interesting synergies and potentials there. Good. Ioannis has been working on a project called the Impressive Project. And the impressive project has been looking at how to tackle pollution. On a perhaps not on a different scale, but in a very different, environment.
00:15:30:22 - 00:15:48:20
Abigail Acton
The impressive project is concerned with maritime pollution, oil spills and, also wastewater discharges. So Ioannis if I could turn to you? Sometimes it takes a machine to get a job done. Can you tell me a little bit more how the impressive project is using drones and unmanned vehicles to track pollution?
00:15:48:20 - 00:16:16:03
Ioannis Dontas
Yes. Thank you. Abigail. Actually, we wanted to to go further beyond the traditional methods of early inspection and monitoring. This is the basic scope of this kind of work. The oil spill inspection and a quick inspection. And, monitoring of the behavior of the oil spill or the waste waters in the maritime area, in the outside of the garbage and in the vicinity.
00:16:16:05 - 00:16:40:23
Ioannis Dontas
So we wanted to we just use a notebook that a drone and the small catamaran has model A is very, very clean over sailing over the sea. In order to go over the area of the oil spill and, take a small sample of it and check it later on and inspect the, the oil spill and the, its behavior.
00:16:41:00 - 00:16:43:08
Ioannis Dontas
That was the initial idea of it.
00:16:43:10 - 00:16:48:00
Abigail Acton
And how did the idea develop? What sort of data were you able are you able to collect?
00:16:48:02 - 00:17:09:00
Ioannis Dontas
First of all, we need to have something some as an initial triggering, effect, this initial triggering effect for the existence of a potential oil spill somewhere, could be can be delivered from the Earth. Observation data from the satellite to the monitor, all the or all over the Earth, all day, all the time.
00:17:09:02 - 00:17:21:21
Abigail Acton
Okay, so if I may interrupt you, just to be clear, so you get some data from Earth observation satellites, and that might indicate that there is, a spill or discharge, event happening. And at that point, what do you do exactly?
00:17:21:21 - 00:17:56:05
Ioannis Dontas
And then we have this indication of the oil spill and the I automatically unlock the work that is getting is getting off and goes over the area, the suspicious area for an oil spill, and takes some higher resolution pictures in order to give more evidence to the ignition triggering information from the satellite. Then if we if the authorities have the proof that this is this is indeed, noise spill and has more catamaran can go automatically at this specific area and get with a robotic arm.
00:17:56:07 - 00:18:18:03
Ioannis Dontas
As more summary of the water and take it back to the laboratory for testing. This is the way the port authorities can have on their hands. Strong. Maybe this is for, all these species, all the waste water from ships in order to pursue, the shipowners for this kind of pollution.
00:18:18:06 - 00:18:44:17
Abigail Acton
That's fascinating. So basically, these are tools to, to to bring polluters to justice in a way to, to ensure that the polluter really does pay, come the data that's picked up by these autonomous vehicles, and give you the information to actually identify who potentially the polluter was. Do you get enough granular data to be able to pinpoint, who has actually made the discharge or whether where the spill has come from?
00:18:44:19 - 00:19:08:10
Ioannis Dontas
The answer is yes and no. It becomes independent from the in depends on the timing or everything you say is depending on the correct timing. Because when the ship is passing by outside the harbor, okay, the satellite may have a picture of it from the previous hours. And of course, everybody knows the specific position of the ship and specifically their Port Authority's.
00:19:08:12 - 00:19:33:24
Ioannis Dontas
The drone can have a picture of the ship. Also, if the ship usually is in the same position at the time, if the discharges the waste water, for example, we can capture the sea at the very moment, you know, and this is the whole idea and of course the catamaran. Okay. The catamaran can not have a car, does not have a camera and need in order to inspect.
00:19:34:01 - 00:19:45:17
Ioannis Dontas
But until we send automatically the catamaran to take the the oil spill, the sample, we already know who is and what she has done.
00:19:45:21 - 00:20:02:08
Abigail Acton
So, I mean, people have been extracting samples of spills and trying to identify the perpetrators of pollution events. For a while. Your system is autonomous. Can you let us know specifically what what the main differences are and why your approach is so, is so useful?
00:20:02:08 - 00:20:26:24
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, I can tell you that it's a question of precision. It's a question of cost, and it's a question of safety or safety. We need precision in order to to know exactly who has done what and not what the exact time. Of course you need to cut the costs of, we do not want to send people over there to do this job anymore.
00:20:26:24 - 00:20:56:18
Ioannis Dontas
We, people have done, this work a lot of times in the past, sometimes successfully, sometimes not successfully. Then we want to cut the costs down of it. And of course, it's a question of safety for the workers of the port. Authorities would go there and take the salary if the weather is bad, severe or whatever, it's better the machines do this kind of a job, more accurately sometimes.
00:20:56:23 - 00:20:58:17
Ioannis Dontas
And more safety for, as I think.
00:20:58:17 - 00:21:01:03
Abigail Acton
Also, you mentioned, of course, the.
00:21:01:03 - 00:21:02:05
Ioannis Dontas
The, the.
00:21:02:05 - 00:21:20:08
Abigail Acton
The need for real time information and speed and rapidity so that perhaps the, the person, the perpetrator of the pollution event has not gone too far or can still be identified, I guess also deploying these, these systems that are automated is also more rapid than trying to get a response, a human response. A group of people together.
00:21:20:14 - 00:21:52:15
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, exactly. Such a system can be used by the port authorities for constant monitoring of the maritime area around the harbor in all the or the vicinity of the several other areas, the coast lines, etc. and such a system can be used constantly, 24 hours per day, seven days a week, in order to provide, constant information about the status, of the, of the sea, surroundings.
00:21:52:17 - 00:22:26:13
Ioannis Dontas
And of course, this is the basic, use, of course, of such a system. It can be used heavily. It's a system about the can be used for other types of monitoring, pure, environmental monitoring. I would say, the heat of the waves, we can we can have such measurements from the satellites. We can induce these measurements into the systems of the system of ours and have the drones make, some more accurate measurements in order to justify the satellite measurements, etc..
00:22:26:13 - 00:22:30:13
Ioannis Dontas
Scientists love that. A lot of those things guess.
00:22:30:14 - 00:22:48:06
Abigail Acton
And maybe algal blooms. Yeah. Algal blooms as well. Perhaps, you know, eutrophication where there's a sudden rush of algal blooms that show up on satellites. I can see the perhaps sampling those could be really useful for data as well. No, that's absolutely fascinating. Ioannis. Thank you very much. Rosa do you have any questions to put to Ioannis?
00:22:48:06 - 00:22:49:19
Rosa Arias
Yes, I have one question.
00:22:49:19 - 00:22:50:15
Abigail Acton
Yes. Reza.
00:22:50:17 - 00:23:16:08
Rosa Arias
I wonder that, what triggers, your methodology is the Earth observations, right. So I'm wondering, how quick you can act after these. And if you think that maybe citizens can help you monitoring also the spills or, other, phenomena that you want to report because, just as an example, the European Environmental Agency has an app which is called marine litter.
00:23:16:08 - 00:23:40:21
Rosa Arias
What? Which is informing directly the European directive, to our own data on pollution and marine pollution. And, well, it's not focus on spills. It's more, marine litter in the beaches, etc. but perhaps a combination of both could help identify quicker. This is because of the disconnect. Quicker if, Earth observations are not quick enough, which is my question.
00:23:40:23 - 00:24:12:20
Ioannis Dontas
Thank you for the question. Hey, my answer is that the Earth observation datasets for this kind of job can be frequent enough for this, for the use in our in our work, we can have several measurements from satellites for 24 hours. And apart from that, in order to, to cover the remaining timeslots of the day, we can use the drone, in order to inspect the overall area outside of the harbor.
00:24:12:22 - 00:24:41:03
Ioannis Dontas
On the other hand, I could say that the citizen science is indeed used for, litter or, garbage is in the in the sea. And the it was, in it is a successful movement. But regarding oil species, I think that it's not easy to involve the passengers of another ship to do to take the ocean there and give me such kind of information easily.
00:24:41:05 - 00:25:05:22
Ioannis Dontas
Because they are almost very near to the level of the oil spill, and they cannot see it very easily when they are passing by from another ship, for example, the only spills or waste of water is, more easily seen from above, either from satellites or from drones. And this is why we use we use this methodology.
00:25:06:03 - 00:25:22:05
Ioannis Dontas
Of course. It is a very nice idea. Perhaps in the future, citizens flying, over the areas with helicopters or small airplanes, then we could use this capability.
00:25:22:10 - 00:25:40:04
Abigail Acton
But it's the bird's eye view. You really need to get the idea of The Expanse. I hadn't thought of that because, I was also interested very much in Rosa's question. It seemed like a, a logical point. But as soon as you mentioned the notion of the fact that if you're actually down on the water level, you can't really get a clear idea of of what's actually happening in terms of the extent of the spill and so on.
00:25:40:05 - 00:26:02:20
Abigail Acton
Yes, absolutely. Ioannis. I have an extra question for you. I'm wondering whether the data that your systems have collected have actually ever been used, to, to bring perpetrators to book. In other words, have you ever had your data used in, in, in criminal cases or, or, have they been used in, to, to assert liability?
00:26:02:22 - 00:26:39:00
Ioannis Dontas
The only thing I can tell you is that, regarding some recent incidents of the oil species, in Greece and Spain, in the last, 5 or 6 years, if there was this solution on air, we could have avoided. And this, very big, this distributed environment of these activities. Actually, we have the our solution has not been used in some court or anything similar because we are we are still in the we are ending the project this time.
00:26:39:06 - 00:26:50:10
Ioannis Dontas
We are still in the demonstration stage. Absolutely. This time, but we hope in the future. Yes. So we have already some positive reactions from Port authorities.
00:26:50:13 - 00:26:56:08
Abigail Acton
So perpetrators watch how to drone is coming to you. Yes. Excellent. Yes. Fabian.
00:26:56:09 - 00:27:16:19
Fabio Galatioto
My question was about actually applying not just on sea but also on rivers, because, actually rivers, they there are also industrial, emissions. And that could be I should I add in UK that there were quite a lot of spills from industry that are not detected. Exactly, exactly. It can it can be used, of course.
00:27:16:20 - 00:27:46:19
Ioannis Dontas
I was wondering how big has to be the surface water to detect any. So we are currently monitoring rivers and lakes from this from satellites. Okay. Yet a lot of very valuable vulnerable data. Imagine that we can detect from satellites the concentration of nitrogen, not oxygen. What are other, substances diluted in the water of lakes and rivers and so we have the the request, the required resolution to do this.
00:27:46:21 - 00:27:47:04
Ioannis Dontas
Of course.
00:27:47:05 - 00:28:14:10
Rosa Arias
That's wonderful. And by the way, I have a, case study in dynamics where we are investigating industrial spills in rivers in one three. Very important. Well, which is called Rio Tinto. So yes, we can have a connection, but we are, investigating them by the smell, like citizens looking by if they smell chemical products or something in the water of the river, then they map and we are understanding if they come from industries or not.
00:28:14:12 - 00:28:40:08
Ioannis Dontas
Yeah. If the smell is translated actually in reality to a small for glory cloud or something, it can be seen from the, from the satellite, imagine that the satellite can see can detect the hydrocarbons getting out from a broken pipeline gas pipeline, for example. And it can see the concentration of the hydrocarbons nearby the pipeline crack.
00:28:40:10 - 00:28:47:13
Ioannis Dontas
So yeah. So you can have a satellite, the information just for comparing your your own methodology.
00:28:47:14 - 00:28:56:18
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, yes. No. That is a new field. That is a opening like the connection of citizen generating data and satellite data. So for me it's super interesting.
00:28:56:18 - 00:28:57:16
Abigail Acton
Very interesting for all of us.
00:28:57:18 - 00:28:59:24
Rosa Arias
So I really love both of your projects.
00:28:59:24 - 00:29:04:09
Ioannis Dontas
Yes, I began, I think it was a very nice discussion.
00:29:04:11 - 00:29:31:07
Abigail Acton
Yeah. You see, I brought together three very interesting people. Okay. Well, I really want to thank you all very much for sharing your time with us this morning and, for talking through your your really fascinating projects. I like the way that you're all tackling one common problem, but some rather different angles. And, Fabio and Rosa, who knows whether there might be some, some synergies that could develop between between your two, technologies and your approaches.
00:29:31:09 - 00:29:47:13
Abigail Acton
Ioannis we all really wish you a huge amount of luck in the future with regards to being able to bring people to book. I really hope that the information you you managed to get from the data can actually be used to pin people down for for liability and responsibility. Thank you so much for joining us this morning.
00:29:47:14 - 00:29:48:09
Rosa Arias
Thank you.
00:29:49:11 - 00:29:51:03
Fabio Galatioto
Thank you everyone.
00:29:52:07 - 00:30:22:11
Abigail Acton
interested in what other EU funded projects are doing to tackle pollution? Take a look at issue 1 or 2 of the research EU magazine available on the court's website. Cordis.europa.eu from blue sky speculative research that opens the doors for tomorrow's technologies to research tightly focused on finding solutions to the challenges we are facing right now. Cordis highlights work being done in a wide range of fields daily news, articles, interviews, a magazine, and research packs exploring projects from specific domains.
00:30:22:12 - 00:30:41:09
Abigail Acton
The Cordis website has your next long read or coffee break skim through. Interested in applying for EU research grants? Visit the website to see how your work relates to that currently being done in your field. So come and check out the research that's revealing what makes our world tick. Our next episode pokes its head into the virtual reality revolution.
00:30:41:14 - 00:31:03:09
Abigail Acton
What novel devices are coming our way? Will they transport us to new worlds? Change the way we learn? Bring people together. Join me to find out. We're always happy to hear from you. So drop us a line editorial@cordis.europa.eu. Until next time.
Dans de nombreux domaines, la pandémie a réduit notre impact sur l’environnement naturel, mais que se passera-t-il lorsque nous en aurons fini avec les restrictions et que nous relancerons nos économies, comme cela se dessine actuellement? Allons-nous également relancer la production de polluants qui nous portent préjudice, tant à nous qu’à la planète? Des marées noires qui menacent nos mers aux mauvaises odeurs qui gâchent notre journée, la pollution nous touche à tous les niveaux. Comment les scientifiques citoyens peuvent-ils apporter leur aide? Que pouvons-nous faire pour préserver l’air qui nous entoure des virus et de la pollution particulaire? Pouvons-nous vraiment faire payer le pollueur pour les déversements de pétrole et d’eaux usées dans nos mers et nos océans? Dans cet épisode de CORDIScovery, nos trois invités financés par l’UE tentent d’apporter des réponses à ces questions. Rosa Arias est une ingénieure chimiste spécialisée dans la pollution olfactive. Elle participe au projet D-NOSES, qui fournit les outils nécessaires à l’enregistrement des données provenant de l’un des capteurs les plus sensibles à notre disposition: notre nez! Ensuite, Fabio Galatioto explique comment lui et ses collègues, dans le cadre du projet APA, ont mis au point une technologie de rupture destinée à révolutionner notre approche des purificateurs d’air chez nous, au travail et dans la rue. Enfin, Ioannis Dontas, physicien spécialisé dans les sciences des matériaux et des surfaces, nous explique comment le projet IMPRESSIVE utilise des drones et des données d’observation de la Terre pour protéger l’environnement.
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Mots‑clés
CORDIScovery, CORDIS, podcast, pollution, odeur, marées noires, purificateur d’air